Re: What a joke of a game this has become : Tue Nov 08, 2011 10:11 am  

jonny the leyther wrote:

I don't particularly mind the grandparent rule. My problem is people changing nationalities. Once you represent a nation you should wear your national flag under your name on your club top.

Which is exactly the gripe about Chase, Jonny, as he has been in previous New Zealand training squads and played for the New Zealand Maoris for several years, not to mention playing against England for the Exiles.

Re: What a joke of a game this has become : Tue Nov 08, 2011 10:58 am  

But he hasn't played for a test team.

Maoris and Exiles arn't official tests.

Re: What a joke of a game this has become : Tue Nov 08, 2011 11:10 am  

jonny the leyther wrote:

But he hasn't played for a test team.

Maoris and Exiles arn't official tests.

Either way, both games were against England so I just don't see any situation where it's plausible to play against an international side and then suddenly become that nationality.

Re: What a joke of a game this has become : Tue Nov 08, 2011 12:05 pm  

Maybe so, but I still don't get why it means the game has become a joke.

Maybe International laws and nationality laws have, but the arguement that you can aim this specifically at English RL, when we have only Rangi Chase to moan about baffles me.

Jarryd Hayne, Leslie Vainikolo, Tony Cascarino, John Barnes, Zola Budd. How far do you want me to go back that it isn't big bad Super League's fault that Leigh fans have got a chip on their shoulder and blame them for everything?

Even things that arn't there, with stupid, made up arguements with no evidence or fact to back them up.


The arguement that a third string Australia team would beat England is laughable, when they cant even beat us by more than 10 when we are missing six players, including our four best props. The silence is deafening on that.

Re: What a joke of a game this has become : Tue Nov 08, 2011 12:24 pm  

You're not reading the post Jonny. As I've said, prior to this season I hadn't missed an England/GB home game in 10 years so to say my dismay at RL stooping to the depths of basically admitting we can't produce our own players, or at least giving that impression to the 'outside world', because of being a bitter Leyther, 'big bad Super League' (even though I probably go to at least a dozen Super League games a season) is frankly ridiculous.

I caught the last few minutes of Saturday's game in a pub in Edinburgh and as you can imagine I was talking up RL to anyone who was listening, but someone brought up the question of Chase's inclusion in the side and I'm not sure "oh, well the cricket team get away with it" is a valid excuse. We have kids at amateur clubs all over the place who dream of playing for England, but they effectively see their route blocked because it's no longer considered wrong for us to pick someone who only plays in this country because it was the best contract offered to him three years ago and because he isn't good enough to be picked by his own country. How can that offer hope for the future and improve our international prospects?

Re: What a joke of a game this has become : Tue Nov 08, 2011 12:42 pm  

I dont think Jonny was aiming that criticism at you Matt. Youre well known for being reasonable and generally positive about RL in general.

Just to add a point. I think McNamara had a choice to make, either carry on as before (and maybe carry on losing as before) or try every avenue possible to make England as competitive as possible and give us every chance to compete. A winning English team will always encourage youngsters more to play than a losing one. Without wanting to go back to cricket but Kevin Pieterson is hero worshipped and has probably got a lot of kids playing that sport who previously wouldnt have done.

Re: What a joke of a game this has become : Tue Nov 08, 2011 12:49 pm  

It wasn't you I was referring to who was blaming big bad super league.

If you hadn't missed and England/GB game in the last 10 years you musn't have been that upset at Ireland International Ben Harrison or Maurie Fa'asavalu playing for England/GB. Or Jim Sullivan playing for Wales and England, it's always happened. Before we were a twinkle in our Dads eyes.

My point is we produce more English born players than Australia and NZ do to represent their countries.

How do we offer hope to the kids who want to play for England? Winning, the same way the Aussies and Kiwis did when they won major trophies, I bet the New Zealand public really gave two sh!t5 when Nathan Cayless, Nathan Fein, Jason Nightingale and Setaimata Sa were passing the World Cup Trophy about drinking Billy Slaters tears.

I hear it wrecked the game in New Zealand, or, is there more kids playing RL in New Zealand than ever?

Re: What a joke of a game this has become : Tue Nov 08, 2011 1:00 pm  

dick scratcher wrote:

I dont think Jonny was aiming that criticism at you Matt. Youre well known for being reasonable and generally positive about RL in general.

Can I put that in my signature?

dick scratcher wrote:

Just to add a point. I think McNamara had a choice to make, either carry on as before (and maybe carry on losing as before) or try every avenue possible to make England as competitive as possible and give us every chance to compete. A winning English team will always encourage youngsters more to play than a losing one. Without wanting to go back to cricket but Kevin Pieterson is hero worshipped and has probably got a lot of kids playing that sport who previously wouldnt have done.

Fair point, although I long for us to have an exciting English half back that kids can aspire to be, something we're lacking even more so with Tomkins reverting to full back. Maybe Widdop could be that player, and I must admit I find his and Reed's story of effectively chancing their arm in the NRL as something quite inspiring for kids who might feel they get overlooked by the SL clubs etc.

jonny the leyther wrote:

It wasn't you I was referring to who was blaming big bad super league.

If you hadn't missed and England/GB game in the last 10 years you musn't have been that upset at Ireland International Ben Harrison or Maurie Fa'asavalu playing for England/GB. Or Jim Sullivan playing for Wales and England, it's always happened. Before we were a twinkle in our Dads eyes.

My point is we produce more English born players than Australia and NZ do to represent their countries.

How do we offer hope to the kids who want to play for England? Winning, the same way the Aussies and Kiwis did when they won major trophies, I bet the New Zealand public really gave two sh!t5 when Nathan Cayless, Nathan Fein, Jason Nightingale and Setaimata Sa were passing the World Cup Trophy about drinking Billy Slaters tears.

I hear it wrecked the game in New Zealand, or, is there more kids playing RL in New Zealand than ever?

For what it's worth, I wasn't exactly chuffed at Fa'asavalu's inclusion but I hoped it was just a one off. Again, in terms of Harrison, Carney, Brough etc then it comes down to the international prospects of players for smaller nations, something that is improving hugely with European Cup and hopefully the same for the Pacific Islanders that are picked off by the big two down under.

To me, a reduction in the Super League quota and much tighter restrictions on international selection should be one of the biggest priorities for the RFL/RLIF for the near future.

Re: What a joke of a game this has become : Tue Nov 08, 2011 1:24 pm  

At last we agree!

Re: What a joke of a game this has become : Tue Nov 08, 2011 2:07 pm  

Jonny your tash has turnt you into a angry man!! I totally agree with you though, rangi chase is the only player in the England squad that raises my eyebrow and makes me twiddle my tash. Having already got tickets to the final I cant wait to have a great day out and see England smash the Aussies.